"...the American Revolution was all about carving out a unique identity that had as little to do with the British as possible."
H.L. Mencken would agree. His groundbreaking socio-linguistic text "The American Language" chronicles precisely how this evolved on both a regional and national level. I consider it one of the few books that objectively reveals the real character of the United States.
I may be showing my age (in yet one more way!) but, I'm hoping the "great vowel shift" can one day be renamed to reflect what should be a "satisfying vowel movement." I know I've got Dink-Dink in my corner on this one!🐶😉Interesting stuff, this....and, what is a great dove-tail with etymology!
That's an interesting read! I'm learning French at the moment but have been trying to for years. I can't seem to get it down. Due to that, I can't say that I fully get it but anything hooked up to wifi seems to go crazy for me as well and has for years. Due to that, it's extremely hard to learn anything new. I'm just not one to give up! Anyway, I am American but found out through ancestry.com that I am distantly related to the Royals. I wanted to learn French way before finding that info. out however and am interested to find out if there is some sort of connection to the French as well.... Do you happen to know if Anne Boleyn had more of a French connection? If so, that might be a connection to the French because her husband of Henry Vlll was my 11th great-aunt's (Mary Queen of Scots) uncle. Anyway, great read!
As far as I know, Anne Boleyn was very English, but that's an area of history I don't know as much about as some others. I learned French back in middle and high school, and while some of the language is sort of embedded in my brain, most of it is gone.
They say "left" tenant in Canada, too. I lived in Toronto for two years, and their English is just different enough to seem strange. Once, when I had been in the country for only a month or two, someone asked me, "How's your time?" I said, "Tell me what that means and I'll tell. you." (Obviously, it means "How are you?")
Colorado was once a part of Mexico. So there are a lot of Spanish-language place names. It seems that after Colorado became part of the United States, they began emphasizing their Spanish roots by deliberately mispronouncing certain geographic names.
For instance, the town of Buena Vista. Everyone who knows even a smattering of Spanish knows that it's pronounced "Bway-na Veest-a." But saying that in that town will brand you an outsider.
In Buena Vista, it's pronounced "Byoon-a Vista" (the second word rhymes with "mist"-a). Lots of other examples abound.
Typos kill me. I will read and reread the posts I send out every day, and then once I hit "send" to everyone, that's when the typo will become evident. Doh!
in class I had students from all over the world. There were 4 students once, two who were soccer players and two who were tennis players. Two were Australian and two English. The Australians were very easy to communicate with. One of the English guys was harder to understand, but not so bad. By far, the most difficulty I have had talking with a foreign student, including so many from parts of Asia, was the English speaker who I recognized was of the lower class. Someone had to interpret his English for me.
It's pretty wild that there can be greater diversity of dialect from within a country than from the dominant dialects across nations! Nonintuitive, but the math does check out.
Certainly. Along with the massive number of essays and critiques he wrote for "The Baltimore Sun", "The Smart Set" and "The American Mercury", which have been collected in many volumes.
I only spoke Russian when I moved to Denmark at 14. I had English at school and with a tutor prior to that but never practiced it in real life.
But then I was going to international schools the entire time here, so while my English got better, Danish never became second nature. It is definitely my third language.
Oh it's very much its own language, even though there's some overlap (as with many Slavic languages). But I was growing up during the USSR days, so Ukrainian was just a school subject and my friends and family spoke Russian.
So while I understand Ukrainian just fine, I never learned to speak it properly, which is something I regret especially now that Russia's trying to turn back the clock and Ukraine's fighting to establish / keep its own identity.
"...the American Revolution was all about carving out a unique identity that had as little to do with the British as possible."
H.L. Mencken would agree. His groundbreaking socio-linguistic text "The American Language" chronicles precisely how this evolved on both a regional and national level. I consider it one of the few books that objectively reveals the real character of the United States.
Thanks for the mention of Mencken. Would you say that "The American Language" is among his most important works?
I may be showing my age (in yet one more way!) but, I'm hoping the "great vowel shift" can one day be renamed to reflect what should be a "satisfying vowel movement." I know I've got Dink-Dink in my corner on this one!🐶😉Interesting stuff, this....and, what is a great dove-tail with etymology!
Poop and etymology.... you know me.
They go hand-in-hand, but not without the requisite Handi-Wipes!
Could always use a Kleenex in a pinch.
That's an interesting read! I'm learning French at the moment but have been trying to for years. I can't seem to get it down. Due to that, I can't say that I fully get it but anything hooked up to wifi seems to go crazy for me as well and has for years. Due to that, it's extremely hard to learn anything new. I'm just not one to give up! Anyway, I am American but found out through ancestry.com that I am distantly related to the Royals. I wanted to learn French way before finding that info. out however and am interested to find out if there is some sort of connection to the French as well.... Do you happen to know if Anne Boleyn had more of a French connection? If so, that might be a connection to the French because her husband of Henry Vlll was my 11th great-aunt's (Mary Queen of Scots) uncle. Anyway, great read!
As far as I know, Anne Boleyn was very English, but that's an area of history I don't know as much about as some others. I learned French back in middle and high school, and while some of the language is sort of embedded in my brain, most of it is gone.
I bet that you know more French than I do, even if most of it is gone. LOLOL
Duodenum
Duo Dee Numb
Duo DEE num -English I think
Do you ever feel sorry for our friends across the pond? I wonder if they'll ever learn how to speak American.
Left Tenant always makes me chuckle.
They say "left" tenant in Canada, too. I lived in Toronto for two years, and their English is just different enough to seem strange. Once, when I had been in the country for only a month or two, someone asked me, "How's your time?" I said, "Tell me what that means and I'll tell. you." (Obviously, it means "How are you?")
I think I might answer, "it's all relative!"
Dialects in America are like this too, I think. Appalachian and Bostonian are surely two distinct languages, for instance.
Colorado was once a part of Mexico. So there are a lot of Spanish-language place names. It seems that after Colorado became part of the United States, they began emphasizing their Spanish roots by deliberately mispronouncing certain geographic names.
For instance, the town of Buena Vista. Everyone who knows even a smattering of Spanish knows that it's pronounced "Bway-na Veest-a." But saying that in that town will brand you an outsider.
In Buena Vista, it's pronounced "Byoon-a Vista" (the second word rhymes with "mist"-a). Lots of other examples abound.
Do you think they were interested in emphasizing their Spanish roots, or burying them? I could see both/either.
Sorry about that typo. I’ve tried to correct it, but am not happy with the correction. I might change it again later.
Typos kill me. I will read and reread the posts I send out every day, and then once I hit "send" to everyone, that's when the typo will become evident. Doh!
in class I had students from all over the world. There were 4 students once, two who were soccer players and two who were tennis players. Two were Australian and two English. The Australians were very easy to communicate with. One of the English guys was harder to understand, but not so bad. By far, the most difficulty I have had talking with a foreign student, including so many from parts of Asia, was the English speaker who I recognized was of the lower class. Someone had to interpret his English for me.
It's pretty wild that there can be greater diversity of dialect from within a country than from the dominant dialects across nations! Nonintuitive, but the math does check out.
Certainly. Along with the massive number of essays and critiques he wrote for "The Baltimore Sun", "The Smart Set" and "The American Mercury", which have been collected in many volumes.
On a tangentially related note (this one has the same UK and US pronunciation), I had a student job at a phone research firm back in my student years.
I called a company that had the word "Corps" in its name (let's say "Blue Corps).
I got through, the woman answering the phone said "Blue Core," at which point I tried to clarify, so I asked "Yes, is this Blue Corpse?"
She paused, then said, "Yes, it is pronounced 'core'"
And that's how I learned that particular lesson.
That's a good one! What languages did you speak when you first started learning English, or was it kind of all at once?
I only spoke Russian when I moved to Denmark at 14. I had English at school and with a tutor prior to that but never practiced it in real life.
But then I was going to international schools the entire time here, so while my English got better, Danish never became second nature. It is definitely my third language.
Gotcha. How about Ukranian? Is it a full fledged language, or similar enough to Russian so that you could pick it up and navigate with the language?
Oh it's very much its own language, even though there's some overlap (as with many Slavic languages). But I was growing up during the USSR days, so Ukrainian was just a school subject and my friends and family spoke Russian.
So while I understand Ukrainian just fine, I never learned to speak it properly, which is something I regret especially now that Russia's trying to turn back the clock and Ukraine's fighting to establish / keep its own identity.
Neat! Obviously I'm a language nerd, and I appreciate the education. The Slavic language family is like a black box for me at the moment.
Much like LLMs. They call them the Slavic Language Models. At least someone does. Somewhere. Possibly.